video compression [geek thread]

[Miles]

If it really did work marc, then what's with this:

1) Why isn't it out yet?
2) Why haven't they done a public demonstration of it?
3) Why has no one else even come close to such an effective algorithm?
4) How can you break a bunch of data compression laws and yet sit on the technology for five years, and have no credible witnesses? They say they've had it independently tested and verified, but where's the info?
5) How come they haven't managed to patent it yet?
6) Here's the ultimate proof that it's bullshit:

Listed video production services company Media World Communications - formerly the listed Queensland miner Werrie Gold - will pay $11 million in two stages to Adam Clark, 27, inventor and founder of the World of Adams Platform (WAP) group of companies. Media World, a former user of the compression technique, will offer Clark a further $70 million in shares. In return for its investment, the Melbourne-based Media World will receive exclusive international rights to all WAP intellectual property concerning the video compression method.

But it's all just smoke and mirrors:

Here, by the way, are four hints from a corporate perspective "that your claimed technology may be 'doubtful'":

One, a company with $340K in the bank signs a deal to pay you $81 million.

Two, only $11 million of that is cash, the rest in millions of shares "valued" at many times their current trading price.

Three, all of the $11 million is to be raised from the market (generally as part of a bigger capital raising, often involving the sale of shares currently owned by the people that signed the deal with you).

Four, the deal is conditional an all of the above, as well as approval of "shareholders" (the people that signed the deal with you and who want to exit the company with a bag of cash before the technology is proven to be a violation of the laws of mathematics).

If they were legit, why would they be signing with such a dodgy company?

SCAM!!!!

[Shaneus]

News just at hand: This technology will now be incorporated into the yet-to-be-released Phantom console.

[Adam]

Bahahahaha.

[Adam]

See, on one hand, as Simon said, you've got a compression algorithm that it is claimed can pack 20 minutes of video and stereo audio into a 2.5Mb file. ~48k VBR oggs can't even get 10 minutes into a file that size.

On the other hand, Miles believes in time travel. Still, I have to side with Miles on this one.

[marc]

If it really did work marc, then what's with this:

1) Why isn't it out yet?

combination of factors from what i can tell - still in development, only had one guy working on it since inception, platform limited (currently), etc.

2) Why haven't they done a public demonstration of it?

again, from what i can tell, paranoia - they're stuck between a rock and a hard place in wanting people to believe them, but not wanting it to be stolen. while it's unlikely that people could steal the algorithm from viewing a demonstration, they are playing it very very safe.

3) Why has no one else even come close to such an effective algorithm?

who knows - but just remember that there have been lots of revolutions in the past that were very simple and no-one had thought of before. think about fiber-optics for a while.

4) How can you break a bunch of data compression laws and yet sit on the technology for five years, and have no credible witnesses? They say they've had it independently tested and verified, but where's the info?

well then you're going to have to do 2 things. Firstly, i've seen the Tolly report, and read it thoroughly (numerous times).
Secondly, I've seen it demonstrated, and it's quite remarkable. I still have a couple of doubts, but they're fast dissipating.

I have nothing to gain or lose by this being true/hoax/complete bullshit, so i hope you can believe me.

5) How come they haven't managed to patent it yet?

i don't think they've tried.

6) Here's the ultimate proof that it's bullshit:

Listed video production services company Media World Communications - formerly the listed Queensland miner Werrie Gold - will pay $11 million in two stages to Adam Clark, 27, inventor and founder of the World of Adams Platform (WAP) group of companies. Media World, a former user of the compression technique, will offer Clark a further $70 million in shares. In return for its investment, the Melbourne-based Media World will receive exclusive international rights to all WAP intellectual property concerning the video compression method.

But it's all just smoke and mirrors:

Here, by the way, are four hints from a corporate perspective "that your claimed technology may be 'doubtful'":

One, a company with $340K in the bank signs a deal to pay you $81 million.

Two, only $11 million of that is cash, the rest in millions of shares "valued" at many times their current trading price.

Three, all of the $11 million is to be raised from the market (generally as part of a bigger capital raising, often involving the sale of shares currently owned by the people that signed the deal with you).

Four, the deal is conditional an all of the above, as well as approval of "shareholders" (the people that signed the deal with you and who want to exit the company with a bag of cash before the technology is proven to be a violation of the laws of mathematics).

that doesn't _PROVE_ anything

If they were legit, why would they be signing with such a dodgy company?

SCAM!!!!

Whether or not media world are dodgy is something that i'm not up to comment on, and something i don't think you can ascertain from a quote from a who-knows-where source about their bank balance.

[Adam]

Meh. An equivalent will be on sourceforge in six months.

[Miles]

marc, I'll put it this way:

20 minutes is 1200 seconds.

2.5 meg is 2621440 bytes.

That gives you 2184.53 bytes per second.

Let's say they run it at 24 frames per second - that's 91 bytes PER FRAME.

That's good enough to create, oooh, a compressed 80x25 resolution ascii movie maybe?

But full motion video AND sound?

FUCK OFF. 2k/s for good quality audio is crazy enough as is.

[Miles]

Also: Adam, shut the fuck up about time travel, don't make me hit you.

and to this:

who knows - but just remember that there have been lots of revolutions in the past that were very simple and no-one had thought of before. think about fiber-optics for a while.

Yes except fiber optics doesn't break any laws of mathematics or science.

[marc]

Miles:

(A) they're running at 25fps

(B) who said you have to transfer every bit of every frame.


FUCK STICK !!!!

[Tim]

Marc, go read up those links posted on Dans Data.

[Miles]

Miles:

(A) they're running at 25fps

(B) who said you have to transfer every bit of every frame.


FUCK STICK !!!!

Gee, really? And here I was thinking that MPEG2 transferred a new frame each time

So you're getting 87 bytes on average per frame - that's FUCKED. What can you do with 87 bytes? That's a line of text. You're saying that 24 lines of characters can define a full second of video? Okay, so what if you use a bunch more to start a key frame or whatever - that leaves you with even LESS to define each subsequent frame. Where's the audio going in all of this? So you're saying they've not only developed a fantastic video algorithm - they've made an algorithm that does high quality stereo sound in anywhere between 0 - 2000k/s? Given audio is always less than video, say they allocate it 1/4 the bandwidth - 500bytes/s for high quality audio? Jebus christ. A sucker is you.

[marc]

so let me play the devil's advocate here...

how is he doing it then ?

[Miles]

How do magicians make it look like shit disappears?

I sure as hell don't know and don't care - I still know it's bullshit.

[Miles]

See, what's with this?

clean hard drive, clean machines, no wi-fi, no hidden cat 5, nothing !!!!!

final test is next week when we bring in a formatted hard drive and make them stream video to it.

??? So were the hard drives clean or not?

And what do you mean by "clean machines"?

Have you tested it out with your own hardware?

[Shaneus]

The only way I can see it truly working is if it uses a combination of lossless compression (like ZIP/RAR... finding repeating strings and "compressing" them) and lossy compression (mpeg, divx, whatever). Even then, it's doubtful.

I trust your judgement, marc... I hope you're right with this. As I mentioned earlier, the implications for my porn collection are huge.

[Adam]

I want this to be true, just to see the look on Miles's face.

[Ches]

If this is true there won't be a nerd in the world without a stupid grin on his face.

It's a pity that it's impossible.

[Adam]

What was the 20 minutes of TV-quality video and stereo audio? Empire?



You could get that into 2.5Mb, easy.

[Ches]

Andy Warhol's in on the con! From the grave! In space! In my pants!

[Miles]

I want this to be true, just to see the look on Miles's face.

Hey, you could also wish that time dilation didn't occur to see the look on my face.

Or you could wish that pigs flew to see the look on my face.

In all cases, you're going to be sorely disappointed.

[marc]

careful miles - every time you say that, you're going to look like a bigger fuckwit if it works...

[Adam]

Bigger? How is that possible?

[Miles]

Ahahah fuck off Adam.

marc: You didn't answer my last batch of questions, I'm genuinely interested.

Oh and it won't work.

[Adam]

Now I see what you mean by 'bigger', Marc. It's like he inflates every time he says it.

[marc]

??? So were the hard drives clean or not?

apparantly so, although i cannot vouch for that at the moment. we are doing more testing later this week and into next week with hard drives that we have purchased and formatted.

And what do you mean by "clean machines"?

Have you tested it out with your own hardware?

no, but we have inspected the hardware, and everything seems to be in order. we checked the power supplies and they're normal, the wi-fi antenna is unplugged, and there are no unexpected devices in the machines. from a full internal inspection, they are standard apple g4 machines.